More Than Just a Mom with Jessa Raye
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Episode Summary
In today's episode of Project: Mom, I sit down with Jessa Raye, a mompreneur redefining the balance between motherhood and business.
Jessa's heartfelt insights are a testament to every mom's journey in reclaiming her identity amidst the chaos of parenting. From early morning routines with her three little ones to the nitty-gritty of setting boundaries in her business, Jessa shares the challenges, joys, and lessons she's learned along the way. Have you ever grappled with balancing maternal duties with personal aspirations? Then, this chat with Jessa is tailor-made for you. Her journey sheds light on the idea that motherhood is just one chapter in our book.
Come along if you're a parent with a knack for business, aiming for that sweet spot between work and life, or if you're just in the mood for some introspection. Let's explore the YOU beyond motherhood.
Topics Discussed:
How Jessa reclaimed her identity beyond motherhood
How Jessa set firm business boundaries as a mompreneur
Why morning routines matter for busy moms
The importance of shifting from 9-to-5 to diaper duty
How moms can celebrate every facet of their womanhood while juggling all the task
About Jessa:
Jessa Raye is a wife, mom of three, coffee lover, and avid book reader! Jessa helps moms show up for themselves without sacrificing motherhood and without guilt. Jessa hosts Caught up in Motherhood, a podcast where she helps mamas ditch the overwhelm and find themselves again in between all that they do.
Episode resources:
Connect with Jessa:
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Emily Gorrie:
Welcome to today's episode of the Project Mom Podcast. Today, I'm chatting with Jessa Ray. She is a wife, a mom of three, a coffee lover and an avid book reader. Jessa helps moms show up for themselves without sacrificing motherhood and without guilt. She also hosts Caught Up in Motherhood, a podcast where she helps mamas ditch the overwhelm and find themselves again in between all that they do. So Jessa, thank you. Welcome and thank you for being here, is what I meant to say.
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm so excited to be on and talking with you, Emily.
Emily Gorrie:
I am loving kind of this push that I've been seeing lately in this space of women wanting to share more and more about their own stories and their journeys.
Emily Gorrie:
And I love that you're doing it with your podcast and wanting to come in here and share your story with my audience. So first of all, thank you again.
Emily Gorrie:
And I think the more stories we can share, the better off we're going to be as a group, right? As a society.
Emily Gorrie:
As we have new moms welcoming into this. you know, stage of their lives. So I want to talk a little bit about, before we really dive into like the hard hitting stuff, your journey, right?
Emily Gorrie:
Your experience with motherhood, with building a business, hosting your podcasts, and kind of how motherhood navigates and weaves in through all of that. What does that look like for you?
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, absolutely. So for me, motherhood came first. Right? So I was your traditional corporate girl, right? Went to college, got that corporate job that nine to five, and you'll got married, had my first kid, I had a little boy, and everything changed. Right? It's like the whole world just got turned upside down while you're on maternity leave. And you just realize that your priorities are just not what they used to be. and it turned into this long journey of me figuring out how to be mom and then fighting to work in this corporate America. I'm like, I don't want to do this anymore. So
Jessa Raye:
it was realizing that I didn't want to be in that space and figure out, okay, well, what can I do? Because I still want to be stimulated with other adults in a way that is challenging and I can give back and I can do something and still work and make money. Right? Let's be honest. I still needed to. bring in an income.
Emily Gorrie:
Totally.
Jessa Raye:
So figuring out that switch and when I had my son he had some health issues that first year and we were in the hospital a lot that first 12-18 months of his life doing overnight stays and just staying in our local children's hospital because he had some breathing issues and we'd have to go in and so we could connect it to like breathing equipment because he couldn't breathe on his own very well. So that alone was reason enough for me to like throw in the towel and be like, that's it, I'm done. Take me home. So that really pushed me to try to figure out how I could work from home and be more of that full time mommy. And I found virtual assisting. And that's how I got my start. It was a great way to open the door for me to get into this online space. So I started working as a virtual assistant. And then I moved up to project management. and online business management over the course of the last three to four years here. And then I decided that there were more moms like you and like me who were struggling to either get out of the corporate world or they were in this virtual entrepreneurial journey and they were still struggling and going through my own journey of now having three kids and figuring out how do I still work do I still take time for me? How do I still take time for my marriage? And it just seemed to keep getting harder and harder to figure out. And I decided that's it. I have to talk about it. I have to talk to these other moms because I get on like work calls and we talk about how hard it was to figure it out or we'd be apologizing to each other like, Oh, I'm so sorry, my kid needs a snack or I am potty training. I need to go wipe a butt. We were apologizing like no, we We both, all of us, we just need to stop apologizing for being moms while we're working. And like, that's it, I have to start my own podcast and I want to talk about it. So that really started my push to want to help other moms and highlight this balancing act of it's not 5050 and leading by example. So I talk a lot about my personal stories and life as a mom of three. And trying to balance now two businesses. So I still do the OBM stuff on the side and I only take like one or two clients for that. And then this mom business where I'm trying to do a little bit of coaching and a little bit of just helping moms navigate and reconnect with themselves. Because you become mom and you come so consumed with it. It's like, where's Jess? Where's Emily? We're gone. So helping us reconnect. as well. And then you're right, being mom, being a wife and doing the hundreds of things on our to-do list.
Emily Gorrie:
I mean, it is, yeah, I mean, it is very true, right? We, there are so many different facets of what we focus on day in and day out that it really isn't a 50-50 balancing act. It's which ones do we have to navigate each day? And I wanna jump back a little bit to, you know, if you're willing to share the kind of experience that you had with your first son. and the navigation of leaving your career. And I know you had shared that it got to a point where there was a lot of hospice days, overnight stays. It just really wasn't, it sounded like it wasn't all that feasible any longer. But can you talk to us a little bit about the internal journey that you went through as you're navigating being a new mom with a child who needs your. needs you present and focused and rested and ability to advocate for him in a lot of these scenarios. How did you navigate the leaving of your corporate job? Was that a simple no-brainer, or were there some emotions in there that you had to also support yourself through?
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, it was very emotional, for sure. I am a first generation college in my family. So there is this huge weight on my shoulders of I need to do something in this world of business of being productive, because I was the first one to graduate college. So there was this external weight, you know, from external family of like, I was the first one in like four or five generations to actually do it. And then they'd be like, Yeah, no, I'm gonna throw it away. is what a lot of people were thinking. And when I would kind of have the conversation of, hey, I'm thinking about being a stay-at-home mom or being a work from home mom. And this was in 2019, 2018, 2019. And this online space, at least for me, was nonexistent. It was totally new. And for my family as well, it was very new. So I had a lot of skepticism around, you can't do that. And what are you talking about? Like you went to college, you have... all these student loan debts, you work so hard, you're just gonna throw it away. And that was a lot of the mentality of the people around me of you're throwing something away. So there was this big pushback of, okay, am I actually throwing something away? And I really had to reflect on that. And very emotional, lots of crying, lots of conversations with my husband of, am I actually throwing something away? Or am I pivoting? And it turned into this decision of you know what, that's it. I need to do what's right for my family and for me. And it was one of those hospital visits, bringing in the laptop and trying to work and trying to deal with the corporate world. I worked in human resources. So trying to help employees with things and working in the hospital, but also trying to be present for my son who, you know, when they're that little, I think he was nine or 10 months old and they have them in these and the cribs are like fully enclosed. So it just to me, like it looks like this cage that they're in. And that is so emotional to see your baby in like this crib cage set up, connected to these monitors. And then you're trying to work. And it was that moment of what's my priority. Just sitting there with this laptop, like making myself sick with the stress and the anxiety of trying to respond to emails. while my son's over there getting taken care of by doctors and nurses. I'm like, this isn't right. Right. So it was at that point that I'm like, that's it. I need to be done. And having that conversation with my husband and I started to look for a way out. And I found a course that I could take as a virtual assistant to become one. And I wasn't ready to make the jump. And it was around a month or two later. So it was maybe 11 months old before his first birthday. Um, my FMLA had ran out and I no longer had really like that job protection anymore. And I remember there was just this one day driving into work and like my job's not really protected and I had just dropped my son off to my mother in law to watch him and he was sick. So it was leaving him there, you know, tears running down my face, crying to go to work and I was no longer fulfilled in it and just crying and like, I can't do it. I can't do it anymore. and it turned into like a mutual separation between me and my employer. I was no longer happy, they were no longer happy. We didn't even do a two weeks notice. There we just agreed to just be done. So I took my little bit of a 401k, cashed it out, bought this course, and it was a 12 week course, and I was so determined to make it work. I did it in six. And I got my first two clients maybe a month or two after finishing. So I was really determined, really pushed and was able to just really start something. And lo and behold, I started in January of 19 and then the world closed in March. I was like,
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, great. Add a pandemic.
Jessa Raye:
yeah, add that to it. But it ended up actually working out okay. Cause I had those two clients and I was able to keep them. through the pandemic, my hours fluctuated like, okay, great, you're gonna work 10, 15 hours, pandemic, okay, maybe I can give you five. So it was survival mode, but we survived it, we got through it, he got healthier, thank God he did not have to go in during all the pandemic stuff. And to this day, we don't even know if his breathing issues, like they could have been COVID related, we just don't know it because there wasn't any testing. point, you know, because it was like right before everything really started and COVID became a thing. So even to this day, that actually, we don't know, he had breathing issues, it could have been at this point, there's no way to know. But after probably after that, that period there, his health got a lot better. He does have asthma and allergies, but we're able to manage it. Now that he's a little bit older, because it was just that age where he couldn't tell me he needed something and I wasn't safely able to give him medication at home because he was so little. So we had to go in for him to get like breathing treatments and things done. So it was just this big, very emotional kind of decision. And it kind of got thrown at us for me to stay home because we couldn't do it anymore. And I think another factor was, was daycare. My mother-in-law watched him a couple of days a week, and then he was in daycare a couple of days a week and he was regressing at daycare. you know, like he could roll over and he could sit up and then he stopped rolling over. And it was just like these other things on top of like he wasn't getting the care that I was expecting him to get at the daycare. So it's like these things just kept adding on to my reasons why I needed to be homeless. And to this day now he's four, you know, turned five in a couple months and I don't regret it. It was rough, absolutely and emotional, but I would do it again. And if anything, I wish I did it sooner.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, I really appreciate you sharing that with us because there's a lot of, there's so many nuggets in that of like, you know, paying attention, right? First and foremost, like trusting what's being thrown at you essentially, right? Wasn't something that you probably ever expected when you became a first time mom, right? Having to navigate this in a way that was unforeseen. And you're just getting more and more. reinforced messaging from the universe, that perhaps this is something you really need to consider for a handful of reasons. Add that to your list of why. And I think the biggest thing that we can do as moms, first and foremost, is trust our instincts, trust our guts. Something's just not right here. I don't know what the answer is, but something just doesn't feel right. So I'm open to possibilities. And I want to also just quickly touch on this identity piece, because You had mentioned right at the beginning of this journey of this narrative that there were these expectations of you from other family members, are you throwing something away? You worked so hard. You were the first one of us to graduate college, so on and so forth. And we get to a point where we've shifted identities in a lot of ways when becoming a mom, but in terms of what our priorities are, right? We are no longer just the child. of our parents and our grandparents who have worked really hard for us to be able to get to where we are and make the decisions we are, but at some point that shifts and we no longer are or should no longer be responsible to our parents, right, or to the older generations and we are responsible for our children and our partners and the lives that we are creating on their behalf. And I want to talk a little bit about just identity and kind of recognizing this shift. You mentioned it, right? It's like, you realize at a certain point, you had to do what's right for you and your family and your immediate priority. So talk to us a little bit about... like reclaiming that, kind of really identifying. And I know that we can run the gamut on this, but it's like you've identified now at this point that your family is the priority, your immediate family. How did you go from, you know. being Jessa as a daughter and as a granddaughter and a first-time college graduate to a mom of this darling little boy who you have to advocate for and really have no clear answers to getting this course in virtual assisting and moving on to where you are now with three kids. How did you reclaim? your identity through all of these. Because I imagine they continue to shift. So what did that evolution look like for you? And what's some advice that you would give somebody who perhaps just knows something has to change, or something just doesn't feel right, and just doesn't exactly know where to go next?
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, that's a big one. And you said identity was so hard and you throw into that postpartum on top of it, right? Like going through all of the things postpartum, and then throwing in this loss of identity or the switching and changing of identity and figuring out who am I and what's important and how do I do this? And for me, it was in the moment, it was a lot of trial. an error. Like he said, it was knowing that something had to change, but not knowing what it was. And for me personally, I'm very fortunate and very lucky that I have a very supportive husband. So we had a lot of conversations around it. And I was able to be really open and honest with him and talk about my feelings and how things weren't working. And to be honest with you, for me talking about feelings was really hard. I am the oldest of three and raised by a single mom. So I was in a lot of ways, you know, mom number two to my younger sibling. So for me growing up, I was always caretaker even. So having those conversations of well, how do you feel like my husband like pulling teeth trying to get me to open up those first couple years when we were first married and then having our son to, you know, just that shutting down and internalizing. So that was a huge step for me to open up and have a conversation. and be honest with myself and honest with him and like sit at that kitchen table. And we would literally sit there for an hour or two hours and we would just sit there because I couldn't physically bring myself to talk for a while, because I just couldn't get it out. But having his patience to sit there with me and just wait it out as I figured out how to voice what I was feeling and having his support in the non-judging. I think that was part of it. I was afraid to voice my opinion or voice my feelings out loud because I didn't want to hurt his feelings or burden him with how I was feeling. So going into the marriage side of it, having that support of someone and having him constantly say, no, we're going to this together. We'll figure this out. We're going to do this. You know, us against the world mentality, really. was really helpful for me to open up and be like, okay, I'm not happy. I know this isn't working. And I don't know what to do about it. And a lot of it at the time was, you know, reading books and Google, right? And just going, you know, how do I fix this? How do I do this? And that's how I found the virtual assisting stuff to just figure out like, I can do this, I can work from home and still use my education and do something. But Knowing that there was at least something that I could do was very helpful. But it was a lot of that communication and finding support. So like I said, my family was hesitant. They tried to be supportive, but they were very hesitant. My mother-in-law was very supportive and to this day is still very supportive. And she's literally watching my kids right now and is great. But I think the biggest thing is having that support group and having that open communication, even if it's just with your spouse, to be able to talk to them and tell them how you're feeling. In a lot of ways, it kind of validates for you because you're getting it out. And for me, I just, and we have this conversation now where we practice this whole, well, what do you need from me? I need you just to listen so I can vent. I don't need you to fix it. So a lot of times when I go to my husband, he does this to me too. we started the conversation out with, I just need to vent or I need help problem solving. So then we what we're expecting out of it. So he knows, okay, she just wants me to listen so she can vent and either agree or disagree, like, yep, you're totally right. That's totally not fair or whatever, or I need help problem solving an issue. So I think having those kinds of conversations and those expectations in place is huge. And with the communication piece, we also started doing this, I hear you statements. And this is something I learned from working in human resources when I would work with employees was I hear this or I understand that you're saying this. And then I repeating it back in my own words, what they're saying to make sure that there's understanding and then you're feeling heard is so important. Cause there's a difference between listening and hearing. So making sure that we're actually listening and paying attention and there's no phones.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, oh yeah,
Jessa Raye:
Right?
Emily Gorrie:
that's a huge piece of the puzzle. Yeah.
Jessa Raye:
Yeah. And just having that conversation. And then the other big part was just taking time for myself. And I know people talk about self care all the time, like, oh, you gotta do self care. And there's so many people out there that say, well, self care is this. They pick this box and say that it has to be these things. And I'm of the group that self care is whatever. makes you happy. And that's going grocery shopping by yourself, and that's going grocery shopping by yourself. If it's a spa day, it's a spa day, but it's whatever works for you. And it's making sure and taking that time to do whatever makes you happy that makes you feel good or makes you feel special about yourself. And one of the things for me was when I started working from home was I like tried to give up all of the things that made me happy. like, okay, we have to we have a tight budget, I need to stop doing all these extra things. Like I cut everything out. And then it was this realization of I was no now no longer as happy either because I wasn't doing all the things that I enjoyed. And having that realization of okay, well, I need to bring some of that back somehow. And figure out how to how to do it on maybe on a budget instead like getting my hair done. I ordered this pandemic time too. So I ordered hair dye. through one of those online systems instead. But, and then the nail stickers, I did those too, because I still wanted, I wasn't going to the office anymore, so I didn't need to wear office clothes, but I enjoyed having some of those polished things. So I still try to figure out a way to do those things in a way that worked for me in the moment. And just finding that balance of this is what I'm gonna do and when I'm gonna do it. and then prioritizing and scheduling it. Like for me, that's something that I needed if I didn't write it in my planner or put it on my calendar, I wouldn't do it. Like I wouldn't hold myself accountable to myself and prioritize my own things. Like, well, I need to work on my client stuff. Well, no, you need to take this half hour or hour for you. The client stuff will always be there. And your self being is always going to be something. And that has taken even now years. right, to kind of continually work on of prioritizing self and saying, no, I'm important too, and setting those boundaries around my own self care, my own needs as mom, and as Jessa, or as a wife, and still taking those times for those different buckets.
Emily Gorrie:
Totally, and I think such a powerful message of what you're sharing too is that it starts with you. So if you think about the experience you had with your husband, yes, he was a perhaps pivotal part in allowing you the safety perhaps, or giving you the permission to give yourself the safety to be open about what it is you were feeling, but really it was down to you and up to you in order to take some... pauses, maybe it took you an hour or two the first time, but it gets a little bit easier each time you do it. But really to reflect internally on what it is that you're feeling. It comes from within. We can only expect so much from external sources. Your husband can only do so much in getting you to the table in order to do the reflection. And when it comes to the self-care and the reprioritization of your day, it comes down to you to enforce that. for yourself and give that to you and not play a role in this martyrdom of how a lot of us as women show up as moms and as business owners. And I can so relate to your anecdote of kind of taking the things that gave you joy off the table. Like I even sent this to my husband this morning. So I shared with you right in just, I have about two months left of my second pregnancy and I… just started going to a pelvic floor physical therapist. And
Jessa Raye:
Yay, love colorful.
Emily Gorrie:
yes, and it has been a game changer for me. Physically, I just feel so much better in my body this go around, but it's out of network because if we go through insurance, it takes forever. I couldn't get an appointment for months. I mean, we won't go into like the whole, you know, craze that is the medical system these days, but basically we're paying out of pocket for this therapist. And I was talking to him this morning, and I was like, I was expecting more of it to go towards a deductible or out of network insurance cost and whatever. And I was like, I got so angry and so frustrated this morning because I was like, I'm not worthy of this cost. I thought more of it was going to go to. And he's like, are you kidding? Of course you are. Like, it's going to, it's in the long run, work wonders for, it works wonders for me mentally right now, because I feel better, I'm moving better, you know, there's so many positives and benefits to doing it, you know, in pregnancy prior to, you know, delivery and whatnot. So logically, I see it, but internally, it was like a huge debacle for me. And I think, right, we are the first as women, especially if we are in a stage in which we are primary caregiving and secondarily bringing in income, right? It's like my husband brings in bulk of the money these days. So it's like the worth factor of, are we worthy of this money? Am I sacrificing myself? And it really comes down to us, ultimately, to put pause on that. Because my husband can say day in and day out until he's blue in the face, you should do this. You're worthy of it. But until I believe that, then I'm I mean, I'm the one that's going to be canceling those appointments, which I'm not doing. I'm not saying I'm doing that. I'm going to keep them. But it really comes down to that. I mean, even if we are aware and we're reflective of that. So I can really resonate with that experience that you had. Maybe talk to us a little bit about when you started to recognize that martyrdom for yourself. So at this point, how many kids did you have? Was it just your son still? Did you have any of your subsequent children at this point? And were you able to, like, how did you recognize that you were sacrificing yourself? And how did you then put things back into place, whether it be some of those smaller things that brought you joy? Like, how did that evolution occur?
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, I still am my first. And I think for me, it came down to in a lot of ways, basic hygiene. Like it was the postpartum period for me still. And this was even like before leaving the corporate world. It was not taking care of myself. Because they said they bring up that now not feeling worthy and things like that. It was not taking care of myself as much as I needed to. And then once I started working from home, it was again that feeling of not doing enough. Like if I'm only bringing in five hours of work a week and I think at the time I was maybe 25 dollars an hour so not a lot of money. Definitely not replacing my income from working full-time in corporate. But at the same time we didn't necessarily need the income like we could survive but we had to make sacrifices and cuts and I felt like I had to cut And that's how I saw it. I saw it as a fault, not as something positive or.
Emily Gorrie:
So instead of you and your husband both looking at the book, so to speak, and combining or figuring it out together, you felt the need just to take your things off the table.
Jessa Raye:
and then I wouldn't tell him.
Emily Gorrie:
Hmm.
Jessa Raye:
You know, I just did it and I wouldn't tell him. So then he'd be like, well, you haven't gotten your hair done in a while. Like, are you doing something new? Or I noticed you've been doing your own nails or I noticed this and like, oh yeah, no, I just couldn't get an appointment. And then I wouldn't be honest either about it because I felt guilty. Cause I wasn't, I didn't feel like I was contributing. So then it would, it came down to, in a lot of ways that basic hiding, you know, not really showering, not getting dressed. really and like just throwing on like that nice shirt because I had a zoom call with a client piece and it was and then the world was close too so it's like well what's the point and I don't remember exactly what the turning point was but it was something with getting ready to like go somewhere and do something with family like we were finally going to see family like standing in the mirror and they're like, I am disgusting. And just the physical part of it, I think really got to me, like just standing there in the mirror, looking at myself and being like, what happened? and just like, literally like making eye contact with myself and having all those negative voices just literally start attacking myself in the mirror staring at myself and just having these feelings of inadequacy of not being worthy and not being good enough. And there just came this point where I'm like, okay, that's it, I need to be done with this like, not worthiness. And I started to say in the mirror to myself because I started hearing about affirmations, but I'm not a big writer. And that's a personal like hiccup thing that I have. So I don't like to write things down unless I have to. It makes makes it real. I like I know like, oh, you need a journal like, yeah, that's still an issue for me because you write it down, it becomes real. What if someone reads it? And what if I don't want them to read it? So it's a whole mental issue that I'm working through. But So I wasn't comfortable writing down like affirmations yet. So I started doing them in the mirror. And for me personally, that was more powerful. And I started to say to myself, I am a priority. And I would cry. Cause I had to say, I'm a priority. My son is a priority. My marriage is a priority. Money is not a priority. And I would have to have these conversations with myself in the mirror, making eye contact with myself. do a little bit of crying with it too and just reconnect. And then I started writing down the things I wanted to do like my goals. I'm going to shower today. I'm going to get dressed. And for me, those are really big steps like I have to get dressed like even to this day, three kids in, I don't feel productive. I don't feel good about myself if I don't get dressed. I don't know what it is about it. But I, I have to get dressed to be productive. Otherwise, I just feel lazy. So I have to do it. And I feel that with each kid, it was kind of starting over, but I wasn't running over at zero. You know, because like you, you have the kid, you become mom, you are so engulfed in being mom and being with this new baby. And nursing for me was a struggle. The first two times the third time I was like, This is so easy now, I figured it out.
Emily Gorrie:
yep, you've been through all the trials and tribulations at
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, yeah. So just that growing period of that too, that I feel like I started over a little bit, but I had a better arsenal of supplies, I knew what I was doing a little bit better to bounce back quicker. Like I let myself have those pajama time in those first couple months postpartum and let myself have that because I knew I needed it. And then like, okay, now I need to start reintroducing these things to feel productive again. And giving myself that permission to do those things and to take that time and reprioritize myself internally. And like I said, I'm not a big writer, but for me, it was the verbal part of it that really helped me kind of turn around and do those things. And I have conversations with moms about that all the time. Like, they're like, I don't have time. I don't have time to do this. I don't have time to do that. I'm like, okay, I get that in the morning after you brush your teeth. look in the mirror and look at yourself and say I'm a priority. I'm like, I don't know if I can like, okay, I want you to do the opposite. Look in the mirror and say I'm not a priority. My kids are not a priority and see what happens. I cried. That's the point. It's you it's like to shock you into being like, oh crap, that is a priority. Like, the negative voices in your head are right. They're just so strong. We got to shut them out. And it just takes, you know, you got chisel at it little by little. to get it to go away. And in no way am I gonna say that I'm an expert at it or that it's perfect. I still have my days and my moments that are hard and need to remind myself of those things. And I get my nails done now and I can tell you probably once every couple months, I'm like, I should cancel that. But it's still there, but it's a better handle on it. I think now I'm like, no, I'm not gonna do that. Like it just, it sneaks in. that not worthiness stuff, right? And we got to keep in mind.
Emily Gorrie:
yeah, that it's still there and stop it before it changes your actions.
Jessa Raye:
Mm-hmm. Yeah,
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah,
Jessa Raye:
absolutely.
Emily Gorrie:
that's a, I mean, it is really incredible that as moms, and I think you're right, like you add the postpartum period to things and we are really hard on ourselves because especially with the first, I mean, I have one, I'm going in to this period again with my second and I'm not so sure what to expect this to go around with. I had nursing struggles with the first. I'm hopeful for the second, but I'm reminding myself to take some of the pressure off. And I think we can only do so much to kind of predict how things are going to go. We just have to really take it day by day and remind ourselves that, yes, you're right. We are a priority. We are worthy of getting dressed in the morning and getting out of our pajamas. And you know. But if we want to stay in them, that's our boundary too. It's up to us to make those decisions. And maybe we can talk a little bit about boundaries of, once we're at the point of recognition and we, and perhaps this is something that you do or you help your clients with or you've gathered some of this advice from the moms that you talk to on your podcast as well. What are some of those boundaries? look like and how do you navigate some of those non-negotiables when those boundaries get pushed? Because ultimately we have to enforce them, right? I mean, it's up to us to say, yes, I'm a priority. This is what I need today and I'm going to do it regardless of what comes at me. So how do you navigate that? How do you help your clients navigate that? And what does some of that enforcement look like? Like how can we support ourselves through that?
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, that is definitely a hard one. Like I said, because I find even for me, the ability to say no, it's like it's so hard because you're, you're pleasing, you want to please the other person, you don't want to hurt their feelings. And it's that conversation starting point of, okay, are their feelings more important than your wellbeing? Like, are you willing to make yourself sick? Because a lot of times the anxiety, the stress of it is so strong. You're making yourself physically sick. Is that really worth making that other person happy if you're making yourself miserable? And really thinking about that can be hard sometimes, but being able to say no and practice saying no. And I do some exercises sometimes of how to say no without actually saying the word no. And those can be hard, but it's kind of fun to say a little bit of a challenge to try to figure out, okay, how can we nicely write, because we don't want to hurt their feelings, say no, and still hold that boundary. And it's fun is also really hard at times to figure out how to say that. But just taking the time to figure out what those boundaries are, I think is the first big piece of what is my boundary. And For me, a lot of my boundaries came into play with prioritizing my internal family unit. Like you touched on it earlier of being mom versus being a daughter or granddaughter or niece or cousin or whatever. And prioritizing that role as being me and being mom versus being this to somebody else. And knowing that role is more important. And it took for me. becoming mom to really realize like, no, this is important. And I need to prioritize this role and figure out what my boundaries are. And for me, having a kid and having now three, they were the strongest pieces for my boundaries. I don't want to expose them to XYZ. I don't want them to have this kind of relationship or I don't want to mess up their routine. even something as simple as like, you know, the bedtime routine. You know, I will I'm in that stage that mom era, I think they call it now of my kids are in bed at a certain time, so we don't go out. Or if we do like, it's a big conversation with my husband and I are like, Okay, are we really gonna do this? And what does this look like? And what does this mean for the next day? And if I have client calls the next morning, and they want us to go out with the family that I probably No, I got calls in the morning. I can't mess up that sleep schedule. You know? Yeah, it is right. So knowing what those boundaries are, I think is so important. And then being on the same page. Like, like I said, like for me was being on the same page as my husband and so like, these are these are my boundaries. These are my nose. And then letting him, you know, tell me his and what his boundaries are and what his nose were. And then being in that together, I think was big. And he would let me, he used me as the excuse because we had some issues with my family and he'd like, oh, he used me as the excuse. So like some of the times like, oh no, Rostes doesn't want to, that's my husband's name. He doesn't want to, or he can't do that. And that worked those first couple of times as I built up that confidence to say no. And then it was, no, actually I don't want to. And it took practice like it was hard like I would have anxiety over like either texting or calling the other person to say no. And now years later, it's no I'm good. It's just it's so hard to think about when you're in the moment of saying no for that first time to where I am now I'm like, it'll get easier. I know people say that but believe me it will get easier. and it'll become second nature for you to kind of like take that second when that text comes through, or that call comes in saying, Hey, let's do this, or why won't you do this? Or, you know, sometimes it's taking it that too far, like those gas lighting moments and things where you need to really think about and say, No, and it can be so hard. But once you say no, it's like this pressure and this release of energy just leaves you and you're like, Okay, that's done. It's over. I survived it. And a lot of times those first couple times, I would say no, I'd have to give myself a reward. You know, just like that little bit of encouragement of okay, I said no, I'm gonna go and I'm gonna you know, have my little treat because you know, it's postpartum and I'm trying to lose the weight.
Emily Gorrie:
I love that.
Jessa Raye:
So I'm gonna have my little bit of ice cream. I feel better.
Emily Gorrie:
I mean, we do that with our kids, don't we? I mean, I do that with my kids. I'm like, you had a really hard day. Like, let's do something that brings you joy today. Like, to go get ice cream? Do we want to go to the playground? Do you want to, like, things that we don't, like, do regularly, but it's like, okay, this seemed to be a hard day for you. Why can't we do that for ourselves?
Jessa Raye:
Right, exactly. Or give yourself permission not to cook. Like I feel like that's at least for me, that was always like the biggest hang up was like, I have to cook dinner, I have to cook dinner. And there's just so much pressure around dinner. And I got to the point now where I'm like, nope, there's no pressure. Like, I have a busy workday, and I've either put something in the crock pot already, or I already know we're gonna have dino nuggets. You know, our mac and cheese.
Emily Gorrie:
freezer is your best friend.
Jessa Raye:
Right? Or you know, my husband's gonna go pick up fast food or whatever, like there was a moment in my life where I felt like I failed if I didn't make dinner.
Emily Gorrie:
I'm like, yeah, no, I'm lucky to get to eat it in the first place. Why
Jessa Raye:
am I stressing about it so much? And just getting past that. And anyway, you're getting ready for your second and just think about that. I'm like, oh, going from one to two was so much fun. And now having
Emily Gorrie:
I'm excited.
Jessa Raye:
love it. Yeah.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, I think there's a lot of joy this go around because I know what to expect. And the first year with my daughter was really tough, really tough. And so I feel now that I've set things in motion prior to that, like pelvic floor therapy, you know, I've hired a birth doula, like I have… Therapy, you know talking about some of these feelings, you know kind of ahead of time and I'm you know Again, and you said it too, right? You go into the second and the third and you know, and you know, you work on setting your boundaries You have tools that you know Can support you this go-around with things that maybe aren't working or you know what not and I have more joy this go-around going into this stage I mean, ask me that again in six weeks. Like, you know, if I still feel the same way and I have a, you know, fear may pop up a little bit. But right now, right, there's so much more joy going into it because of the foundations that I've set for myself. And I just love the anecdotes that you share of like saying no and rewards and giving yourself the permission and. if it means for the first couple of times giving yourself an out and using your partner as an excuse, kind of pending conversations you've had with them. But you guys are a team. How do you set yourself up and use tools to make your lives a little bit easier? And I think it's up to us to ultimately enforce those rules. And first things first, it comes back to being in tune with what you're feeling. Like, why am I scared about this? Who am I trying to please? If I please that person, am I sacrificing myself? Why can't I say no? This person's going to be mad if I say no. Maybe we have to reflect and say, well, does this person really matter in this larger scheme of things? I mean, it's, I think, more of a delicate navigation than perhaps we're simplifying it as, but like first things first, right, starting with yourself. And I just appreciate that so much because we, as moms, give to so many other people that first things to go is usually ourselves and our feelings. And we can't do that to ourselves. It's not fair.
Jessa Raye:
yeah, and to kind of add to that too, with setting those boundaries for me personally, when I was pregnant with my second, we went through a lot of stuff with my family. My youngest sister had passed away unexpectedly, and it's like the whole family fell apart. And for me, I did have to seek therapy for myself because I was really struggling with being pregnant, having my second. and dealing with that because it was a little bit me why I was having a c-section with him because he was a transverse lie. So I had to have the c-section. And I come from a very strong opinionated family of having vaginal births. So I had this huge hang up that I was like cheating if
I did a c-section. So I decided to see a therapist to kind of help me accept that and move past that. And then we dove into other issues too. That I was like, you know, not talking about or not acknowledging. So having therapy that second time around really helped me to like I needed like an outside person to validate because like you said it's so it's so hard and I did cut a lot of family out of my life but I needed that outside person to say that in a way like it was okay like It's like, oh, this is family. Like you, it's ride or die. It's your family. They're there. But you come to this point where you're like, okay, it's not healthy anymore. And it was like, I felt like I was giving up on them or on the situation and on this dynamic and I needed that person who was outside of it in a way to kind of say that it's okay to give up, not necessarily I want to say give up, but it's okay to move on to other things. And you can always come back to it later. So that was huge and that was hard for me. And that was when I was pregnant with my second, he turns two here in a couple of months. And there are some family that I haven't talked to in over two years. And yeah, and it's okay. It's okay, it's hard. And there are days like, you know, birthdays are harder for sure, but I don't think I'd change it. You know what I mean? Like this is how it goes sometimes. And it's prioritizing my family unit. and what I want them exposed to and it's prioritizing my needs and what makes me happy. And then like you said acknowledging those emotions like feeling those feelings that you get when you're around certain people versus when you're not around them and really tuning into that and realizing that okay this isn't okay and why am I so anxious and high strung and like distraught when I'm around certain people and then realizing that it's okay to have those boundaries. And then when those boundaries aren't validated or aren't followed, that it's okay to cut. And that can be a whole nother episode for another day, but you know, it's okay. And sometimes I just wanna say sometimes it's okay to get outside to help and have someone to talk to about it, because it's a lot, even just postpartum stuff and pelvic floor. Like I haven't seen my pelvic floor lady since I was pregnant with my second.
Emily Gorrie:
Maybe it's time, it's never too late. That's what I hear, never too late.
Jessa Raye:
It isn't. It isn't. I had issues with my first and I never saw a pelvic floor because I didn't know it was a thing. Saw her with my second while I was pregnant after and then with my third same thing. I'm still seeing her and I'm about eight months postpartum right now and I'm still seeing her for some stuff because it's awesome. And same thing, I pay for it out of pocket.
Emily Gorrie:
And for, yeah, that again is a whole other episode too, right? I mean, it's like, but we are worthy of those things of support for ourselves. And I think too, like the, a big piece of the puzzle is also like, if you think about, right, like the people that are, and it's, this goes for clients too. I think if you think about it, family, clients, friends, you know, I don't know, delivery people, I don't know, you know what I mean? Like. If you look at the, like everyone comes to the table with their own experiences, right? Their own lens of how they were raised and what their people's expectations were of them and how they process that. So everyone comes to the table uniquely as themselves. And if you can accept that person, that client, or that family member, or that friend for who they are, for the behaviors that they bring to the table, for how they show up, for how they communicate. then OK, right? Then they can still be present in your lives. And it doesn't cross a boundary for you. But if it comes a point where it's stressing you out or giving you anxiety or causing physical ailments in your body, you're right. It absolutely is OK to cut ties temporarily or permanently, whatever ultimately works. And we're always allowed to change our minds. And I think. When it comes to business and setting those boundaries, I want to talk a little bit briefly before we wrap up just how you prioritize your day to support the couple of VA work businesses that you have, the coaching business you're ramping up, and still being a present mom in the way that works for you. So what do your days look like? How do you support yourself with that?
Jessa Raye:
So my days are a little unique in the fact that my kids get up early. So we started our day at 4 30.
Emily Gorrie:
Uh?
Jessa Raye:
I know, everyone's gosh.
Emily Gorrie:
I want to hear all about this because I'm like, if it's seven and you're up, I'm so happy.
Jessa Raye:
My kids go to bed by 7
Emily Gorrie:
Okay.
Jessa Raye:
and they're up by about 4 30.
Emily Gorrie:
Okay.
Jessa Raye:
My middle is my early riser. My older one now, he'll sleep in if he can till 5. And then the baby will sleep till 6 if her brothers don't wake her up. Maybe you know how that goes. So we started at 4 30. And for me, the first thing I do is I get to have those cuddles with him. And for me, that's self care, because I want to make sure that I'm a present mom and I'm not putting my work before my kids. So I love that I get to spend that time with him because he's normally the first one up. So for always looking for ways to spend with each kid by themselves, especially now having three. I'm like, I want to make sure I'm still prioritizing independent attention. So he gets his morning time. So he gets like a half hour, or it's literally just the two of us, and we cuddle and we'll watch Bluey or Paw Patrol. Those are his tops right now. And we'll just kind of cuddle and I get to hold them and it's great. And then, you know, the older one gets up and then it turns into play. And you know, we get the whole day started and go from there and whatnot. So with them being early risers, they do early naps. My younger two still nap, they nap once a day, and they'll nap in the morning, traditionally around like nine. So that's when I start my work, really, is nine until about noon. Is a heavy, is my heavy hitter like nap time hustle time. So that'll be traditionally like my billable hours where I work with my clients, I'll do a call with them and I'll work with them. So that's two hours every day. So that's five days a week, that's 10 hours right there. And on really, really good days. and my kids are independently playing in the afternoon, I can get a little bit of work done like at the island, kitchen island. Or I'll schedule time with my mother-in-law who's again, super supportive and she's retired and she'll come and hang out with the kids for a few hours so that I can work, which is awesome. Otherwise on those days where she can't come over or I wanna be mom, right? I work in the evenings after they go to bed because they go to bed at seven traditionally. So when that works, I get to work again from seven until about nine. And I will say that is where I struggle is I get into that work mode. And the next thing I know it's like 10 o'clock or 10.30. And I'm like, I have to get up at four, 4.30.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, I should go to bed. Ha ha.
Jessa Raye:
Right, I need to go to bed. I'm like, okay, I'm just going to do this one thing. You know how that goes, right? I'm gonna do this one thing. And then it turns into so that is something that I'm still working on. I task my husband, they're like, okay, you have to physically come get me. I'll just keep going because I want to I like to finish what I start. So I like to finish my tasks. Yeah. So at night, I tell him you got to come get me like I even have my phone like I have an alarm set on my phone. And that still doesn't work sometimes.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, hopefully shock you out of the mode that you're in.
Jessa Raye:
And I've actually have it written down in my in my planner. as a for this week actually a um a goal to go to bed by 9 30 to stop working at nine and then do my nighttime routine and try to read and cut screen time before bed out and take that half hour right to jammies wash face read a little bit of book and go to bed so that's one of my priorities for this week and like that goal tracking that we do so it's like my number one this week but Yeah, I think the biggest struggle with that, like so that's just my schedule, but my biggest struggle with that has been internal. Feeling that pressure of I need to work, I need to work, and shifting it to I need to be mom, and having that communication. So like I do have my work stuff on my phone, and having that communication of I will get to this later, and telling the client that like, yeah, absolutely, I can work on that for you, I will work on it this evening. and making sure that I'm clear with them, it's not gonna be right this second. And I make sure that my clients know that I have kids, because I'm gonna tell you, there are some clients out there that don't wanna work with me because I have kids. And I'm like, you know what, that's fine, you're not for me. Like, I have kids, they're gonna be in the background sometimes. And I tell them, I said, if we're gonna have a last second call, they're gonna be in the background, 100% guarantee it. But if we're gonna schedule something out, I can work. with my mother-in-law and I can work around map schedules and get that figured out. But it was giving myself that permission to be okay with that. And switching it like I am mom.
Emily Gorrie:
and letting go of some of those clients who perhaps were not aligned with those values anymore.
Jessa Raye:
So yeah, and then it's saying that I'm mom first and I'm a business owner second. And constantly having that reminder of that. And then being fully present when I'm with them. And I think the last thing is just I block my calendar. Like I have Calendly hooked up to my calendar for people to book stuff with me. And I have it blocked on there. A two hour block every day for lunch. Because that's a priority to me is meal time and sitting at the table. So
breakfast and lunch are blocked on my calendar. And then I am not available after 3.30 until like 7.30. And that's what I have on my calendar too. And my clients don't like, no, this is dinner time. This is my husband's home, family time, bedtime routine. I'm like, I will not answer you during that time period. If it is a fire, we like, we'll deal with that. But let's be honest, they're not actual fires.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, like what? Yeah, for sure.
Jessa Raye:
Like an email didn't go out or something or you know your website something didn't work. It can wait an hour. It's okay.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, totally. Yeah. Is that is life or death on the table?
Jessa Raye:
Right.
Emily Gorrie:
Probably not.
Jessa Raye:
Probably not.
Emily Gorrie:
So give me an hour. Yeah. Yeah,
Jessa Raye:
So having those blocks on my calendar in a way just made it so much easier because I'm like oh I'm sorry my calendar it's not there.
Emily Gorrie:
Not available.
Jessa Raye:
I'm busy. I don't. you don't need to explain it. I feel like I would always over explain like, Oh, I'm sorry, I can't bring much of my kids. And then like lunch really, like I'm done. Like I just stopped explaining. No, I'm sorry. I have other obligations. I just leave it at that. They don't need to know that it's a pelvic floor appointment, or a nail appointment or, you know, Plato. No, I'm sorry. I have other I have another client call and I'm sitting on the floor doing legos or playing with Plato. They don't need to know that.
Emily Gorrie:
They don't. Exactly.
Jessa Raye:
So I think it's just less is more.
Emily Gorrie:
Yep. I love that. I love that. It's like, block it out around the priorities that are valuable for you, right? It's like in the order in which they are important. And I, I think that's such a great practice for us of like identifying where do we feel Like if we feel we're always shifting things around, to like try and prioritize our clients or, you know, how can we re-implement a strategy, whether it be blocking time off on our calendar and just trusting that the clients that will work with us are the ones that will get it and will align with the goals that we have because life's too short. Time goes by too fast. Our kids are only little for so long and if that is the time we wanna spend, then by all means we should be spending that with them.
Jessa Raye:
And we're in this space to be mom, right? Like not forgetting that priority and like the work is secondary. And if it doesn't support it, then why torture yourself? Like, you know, so many people go to those nine to five jobs and they're just unhappy. Like I'm doing this because I want balance and I want to be happy. So why work with clients or someone who doesn't align with that? You know?
Emily Gorrie:
there's also, if we think about the nine to five too, there are also companies out there that will give you an employee. You can be an employee that have a little bit more understanding or flexibility for being parents. And it's OK to say maybe perhaps this job that gave me all this fulfillment before my kids were born is no longer working for me. And I think your story is such a testament to that of. shifting into a mode that allows you to have the priority. But if anyone's listening to, if it's maybe not the job you have, there could be a job. Is there another job that could give you that flexibility? Because I know personally there's a lot of joy that I get of spending time focusing on things that challenge me, that give me drive, that make me feel like I'm learning something every single day. I don't always find that same level of fulfillment if I'm with my daughter 24-7. There are days that when she goes to daycare are so valuable to me to do all of those things. Some work things, some learning, read a book that challenges my way of thinking, or get my nails done. Any of those things are worthy and valid. And I think just being in tune with our own journeys and our own experiences and our own values and what really gives us like, how can we optimize our quality of life as individuals and as moms and as partners perhaps or you know, business owners, like being true to those is going to be what gets us to where we want to go.
Jessa Raye:
Right. Absolutely. And to your point, that's so big. Like, I love working in Canva. And like I redesigned my website recently. And that was so much fun for me. That's stimulating is that balance and finding what makes you happy and you can be more than mom and figure out what that is what makes you happy. And then monetize it somehow.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah. Let's not forget about ourselves Yeah. Exactly. Well, thank you so much for sharing your journey and your story. And I want to just toss it back to you really fast. Where can our listeners find you? How can they engage with you? How can they work with you? Where can they start these discussions?
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, so the best place to find me is on Instagram at the Jessa Ray. And you just follow along on there. And I would say the best first step is I have this guide. It's reclaiming your identity. It's a seven day mom's guide journey, and just takes you through those first couple of steps to reconnect with yourself. And I said it's a free guide. And I've spent a lot of time and a lot of love into that because I want to help moms who are struggling and like, I don't know what to do or I know that I can be more than mom, but I don't know how to start or I feel lost. Like who was I before mom and now I'm mom like, oh, so it's a good guide. It's a good starting point, I think, to get you moving forward and figure out who you are again, what you like.
Emily Gorrie:
Yeah, wonderful. And we'll make sure to link those in the show
Jessa Raye:
Yeah.
Emily Gorrie:
notes. But Jessa, thank you again for being here and for sharing your journey.
Jessa Raye:
Yeah, I love the conversation. Only thanks for having me.