Recognizing Our Role in the Patriarchy with Lauren Gold
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Episode Summary
This episode of Project: Mom is a little different (and super special) because I’m joined today by a real-life friend, supporter, and confidante – Lauren Gold. I met Lauren when both of our daughters were 6 months old at a local motherhood meetup, and we instantly bonded. Lauren has been a source of stability and confidence for me as I’ve navigated life as a first time mom.
In our conversation we chat about how we can break down the judgment and stigma within our own demographic as mothers, the importance of all types of work that mothers choose, and more. This conversation was so cathartic for me and I know we could have talked for much longer!
Topics Discussed:
Lauren’s story of deciding to go official as a an astrologer and leave her corporate job after the birth of her first child
What happens when women become the problem by causing harm through judgment, gossip, and more
Recognizing that no one actually has it all in motherhood and there is guilt that ever mother carries
The need to appreciate Pink Collar Work and realizing how transferable the skillset is that comes with being a stay at home mom
The different ways we can support women without directly buying their product or service and why we need more of this
The reminder that even though your current problems are very real, they will pass
Connect with Lauren:
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emily_gorrie:
Welcome to today's episode of the Project Mom Podcast. Today's episode is going to function just a little bit differently than other episodes. Joining me Today is a close friend of mine, Lauren Gold. She offers coaching from an astrological lens, whether that be in relation to motherhood, career guidance or personal choices when it comes to motherhood and friendship, Laura is my confidant. Right now. we met when our girls were just about six months old and a baby My class. And you know when you just click with somebody. Well, Lawrence, been that integral part of my experience in community as a new mom. What I love about Lawrence is that she's not one to shy away from polarizing topics, and I find that regularly we're talking about things in motherhood, careers, entrepreneur ship, and things that trouble us and upset us and inspire us. So when I first realized that I wanted to talk about today's topic Immediately texted her and I knew that I needed her to weigh in on this with me and then just a solo episode would not do so without further ado. Lauren. Welcome. thank you for doing this with me,
lauren_gold:
Thank you. So thank you for that introduction. It is true. I think when you really click with someone, you just click and we've clicked. so I'm honored to be here to talk about
emily_gorrie:
Yea,
lauren_gold:
anything and everything that you might want to talk about.
emily_gorrie:
Which we may just touch on a little bit of everything and everything today, Because
lauren_gold:
Absolutely.
emily_gorrie:
that's typically how our conversations go, but
lauren_gold:
Yes,
emily_gorrie:
I think we can. We can stay on track today. I'm hopeful
lauren_gold:
Definitely,
emily_gorrie:
for us.
lauren_gold:
definitely.
emily_gorrie:
Um, So before we dive into the story and the topic, I would love if you could just give the listeners just a little bit of an overview of you, your entrepreneurship journey, your motherhood journey, and kind of where you're at right now.
lauren_gold:
Sure. Well, my name is Laurent. I currently have been full time momming for a two year old. My daughter is two years old. Prior to that, I've been working in various facets of tech for most of my career, but I am one of those who had trouble coming back for my maternity leave. made a an empowered decision. I think to pause on my traditional career and lean hard into the stay Home mom life. Recently I have felt called to go. I would say more public or become more official with a side hustle or a passion project that I've always had in my life, which was actually astrology. Since I was in high school In college, I've been reading birth charts for friends for family, friends of friends, and it's slowly just grown by word of mouth, so currently I'm actually an astrologer, N you know, part time will also momming, Really, with the goal of empowering my clients who end up mostly being women, right, women in their twenties or thirties, women going through transitions or changes to, really, you know, own where they are in their lives, and lean on me to really help them navigate those changes. So a lot of change, a lot of excitement, but always interesting For sure.
emily_gorrie:
Well, I love that because I think it's such a true testament to just meeting yourself where you're at right now. I mean, when you mentioned it right, going back to work full time after maternity leave doesn't always look as we expected to, and there's different priorities, different expectations on ourselves, and I think, Um, just so honoring of yourself to recognize that and allow yourself to lean into what works for you and your family right now.
lauren_gold:
Thank you. Yeah, it was hard. I mean, I'm sure will touch on this again. I think that I think I've always been a feminist Because we all, and and I always thought I knew and I always thought I understood what women really went through until I became a mom myself. I don't think I fully could grasp the gravity or the weight of the responsibility or how changed. I would Yell Um by motherhood and I think walking away Um from objectively, a really good job was one of the harder harder choices I've had to make in my life and then continue to live with that decision for the last couple of years.
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, and I honestly think that's like a perfect segu, because I would be surprised if not. you know. if everyone listening could resonate with that, You know. I could imagine that some part of somebody or everybody listening has some experience with that of making a decision that objectively changes the trajectory of this course that they had set forth for themselves at some given time rate choices that they had made, and a really beautiful segued into Why we're having this conversation today, and why I tested you. Because I just a couple of days ago, I know I mentioned this to you want. I'm sitting in this coffee shop. I tried to take a couple of hours when all of goes to take care to sit and focus on what works for me, And I was journaling and it was a table of two women next to me and at the beginning I was trying really hard not to listen, but at some point you just you overhear people's conversations
lauren_gold:
That's
emily_gorrie:
and
lauren_gold:
what you do in a coffee shop.
emily_gorrie:
It is and I was journaling, so I was kind of like Okay, you know, in and out of my journal session based on you know how animated they were in their conversations, and at first I was so thrilled because they were talking about their challenges, just like you and I were just talking about some of the frustrations that they had with making different choices in their careers because they became moms, or how to be present with their kids, And it made me really happy Because that is The motive or the motivation I should say for this podcast Right. It's like I
lauren_gold:
Hm,
emily_gorrie:
want to share stories that so that women know that they're not alone. Right in a lot of these challenges.
lauren_gold:
Right,
emily_gorrie:
Um and I was so thrilled and then I wanted to cry because I was. as the conversation progressed, there became what felt like more and more judgment on the conversation that they were having. They were sharing anecdotes or stories of other women That they had seen, whether it be on social medias or excuse me in their day to day circles, or what not, of choices that other women made, and chose to
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
add a layer of judgment on that and some of that
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
was around. You know they were saying, You know that they were talking about women who chose to participate in multi level marketing campaigns, Network marketing campaign.
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
They were talking about women who chose to pause and be full times At home. You know, Mom about women, You know what would happen if they lost their partners. They, they lost their skill sets, or they were talking
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
about this woman, who as a photographer in, had, was posting her motherhood content on Linked in and they were frustrated
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
because that's not where linked in. That's not linked in is for motherhood Content had no place in that work in the workplace
lauren_gold:
Very
emily_gorrie:
and
lauren_gold:
judgmental, very,
emily_gorrie:
just felt very judgmental and
lauren_gold:
yeah,
emily_gorrie:
I'm fully gutted because to me it feels like these women are the Blem. They're the secret problem, and it makes me feel
lauren_gold:
M.
emily_gorrie:
almost overwhelmed by. like, how do we make progress with this? It? we know men are the problem to an
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
extent right. They also know they're the problem. It, A lot
lauren_gold:
yes,
emily_gorrie:
of the men that I know know that they're part of the problem. Right now. They're part of society that they grew up in That taught them certain societal norms and expectations, and they know that they have to step up and show up and we can ask them to do so in certain ways, Because when women is, the problem makes me overwhelmed in that we don't realize that the things we're talking about are actually causing so much harm in somebody else's individual life.
lauren_gold:
I think there are a couple of things going on here. I mean, first is um, like you sort of hinted at, like the patriarch, right,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
which is, it's very quick for us to say men. You know, it's the men, but we, as women are often part of the patriarch, Y, too, and I think that's often expressed in this like women versus women behavior, Um, and I do feel like as a collective, you know
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
as a gender Not going to be able to advance if we're Um, if there's fighting among us Right, And so I feel like first and foremost, this, like, Um, woman versus women, like girl on girl or working, mom versus stay at home Mom thing, Um is hugely problematic. I mean, it sounds like these two women are working full time, judging their friend or their friends for choosing to pursue other lines of work or lean into. Stay at Work
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
and talking behind her back, Really passing judgment on those decisions. right,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, and it also felt a lot like to me that, like they were making themselves feel better about their choices. so I found myself like in my journal in session writing like, Can I have some compassion for these women? Like this is coming from a lens of themselves. I know writ of experiences that they had, whether in their familiar units or workplace. You know, expectation things like that like, I understand that this is from a lens in which they are coloring it. So my goal is to have compassion for them, But at the same time, How can we just not do that any more? Can we just not have those conversations instead light on how harmful that is? Like I think about it. I'm sitting right next to them. They
lauren_gold:
M
emily_gorrie:
don't know me right,
lauren_gold:
right,
emily_gorrie:
they don't know me, but their their message is actually so potentially harmful to someone in this exact situation. I am a new ish mom. My daughters to the girls are two, and we talk about this regularly. Like what is the next best move for me to have fine Tal, flexibility or freedom or aspirations? How do I? you know? what does it look like to get additional support? Am I still a good mom? Do I go back to work like I'm very much in that space of navigating new motherhood and
lauren_gold:
Same.
emily_gorrie:
business and career, And the, if I wasn't so, I mean, it still impacts me, but if I wasn't so in tune with trying to understand these women or wanting to talk about it, it could cause a lot of damage to some.
lauren_gold:
Yeah, and I'll admit I judged too, right. Um,
emily_gorrie:
We
lauren_gold:
let's
emily_gorrie:
do. We
lauren_gold:
let's
emily_gorrie:
all do.
lauren_gold:
let's
emily_gorrie:
sure.
lauren_gold:
be clear right, like I judged
emily_gorrie:
I'm judging
lauren_gold:
too
emily_gorrie:
them,
lauren_gold:
right. but I think I particularly judged before I became a mom. Um,
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
and then I became a mom, and all of my judgments went out the window because I know how hard it can be. I know how hard it's been for me. I know how hard how hard it's been for my Friends and my loved ones and the other women and moms in my life. No matter what your chosen path is, Um. And so this idea of judgment. is there only one path to our career Paths need to look a certain way. No, um, and I think you're right to assume that those women were maybe coming from a place of self judgment. Um, because they've certainly not walked in their friends shoes, right to be saying the
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
things that they're saying, And and I think I can understand that, too, Maybe like the guilt or projecting of your own insecurities about your choices. Um, and how that that might have played out? I mean, it sounds like that women's friends, the ones you overheard are judging her. Has she lost her ambition
emily_gorrie:
M,
lauren_gold:
her drive? What about her skills? You know, I could argue that her ambition her drive, her priorities, her focus. they're all there. It's just you know, things have shifted at this current juncture in her life,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
And maybe the path isn't going in a traditional way. Um, I don't know. I think this whole like working mom for stay at home, mom thing. This conversation just overall needs to be more supportive and I think it starts in a place like this, A podcast that's meant for women to be having these conversations. I think the conversation needs to be more supportive, especially because the lines are really blurred now with the Option
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
of part time work. you know, part time nanny, um, day cares, flexing hours, people working from home, mor, et cetera et cetera, I mean, it just seems like we all need to kind of relaxing and lean into compassion for each other, no matter where we are in our, in our career journeys or life journeys or motherhood journeys, you know
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, absolutely, and I'm so grateful we can have this conversation because it's one just my perspective and I find that I get very emotionally charged when I get in these situations because I see the disservice that it's doing. but I get to a point where I'm like I'm so narrowed in on just how frustrated I am with that this is happening that I have a hard time Seeing. Okay. What do we do Like? How do we? How do we find solution mode? How do we get to a point? And so I love that just having this conversation starts the process because you know do we like? Should I have said something? Should I have like leaned over like it's not really rolled. Educate these people and they're like
lauren_gold:
Right.
emily_gorrie:
potentially harming state. But An I was in no state to do that either, But like
lauren_gold:
Yeah, you
emily_gorrie:
is
lauren_gold:
could
emily_gorrie:
there
lauren_gold:
have picked
emily_gorrie:
A?
lauren_gold:
Tick to fight in Starbuck,
emily_gorrie:
I could have picked. If yeah, I could. I mean, I would have had a call. You Pick me up from jail, please, Lauren. I got
lauren_gold:
A
emily_gorrie:
to
lauren_gold:
shiner
emily_gorrie:
do a fight. Can you get all it from day care today?
lauren_gold:
H.
emily_gorrie:
I can not make it, but
lauren_gold:
H.
emily_gorrie:
I mean like. So, what do I mean? Is there a place for that like to speak up?
lauren_gold:
I think I think maybe it starts here and it starts with the friends we already have. I mean, you know it would have been pretty bold of you to lean over and say I couldn't help it over here, and I disagree with you completely, but
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, I guess
lauren_gold:
I don't
emily_gorrie:
it would
lauren_gold:
know.
emily_gorrie:
have come
lauren_gold:
like,
emily_gorrie:
out like that.
lauren_gold:
I mean, I've struggled with a lot of these concepts. I think it's been easier to talk to friends in my exact stage. just by coincidence. you know, I happened to meet you. You also happened to not be working when I met you, you know, and so Is really easy to open up and say Hey, I'm struggling with this. Who am I? Who am I without the job title that I worked so hard for Right? Who am I without that salary? What is my value in this world in my household In my marriage? If I'm not bringing in significant income, I mean this American capitalistic society we placed a ton of value on here. Who do you work for? What do you do and how much do you make right?
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
What is my identity? Both Like as a mom and separate from being a mom? Like who am I now? And I think it was easier for me at least in the beginning to have those conversations with people like you who are doing the exact same thing and you could say, Oh, I can totally relate, and we can lament a bit about the struggles that that we're going through, but recently I've I've been more open, I think to having conversations about this with my friends who have chosen to go back to full time work
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
And it's been really eye opening for me because I don't think I realized that they were carrying guilt and struggles of their own as well like, while I'm feeling guilty, maybe about not bringing an income or what am I going to do next? or who am I Now? they're feeling guilt about. you know, maybe not spending as much time with their kids as they like, or they're feeling guilt because they love what they do. Um, and they feel like society
emily_gorrie:
M,
lauren_gold:
is telling them that they need to be caring more about spending time with their. It's right and so suddenly I'm like, Oh, really, no one has at all. You know,
emily_gorrie:
Uh, uh,
lauren_gold:
I might miss my salary right, but they're worried that they're missing out on memories or something. Um,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
and maybe that's where the work starts. Like when you're like trying to find an action plan here? Like, maybe it is having uncomfortable conversations with friends who may have made different choices than you know. right,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, and understand just different perspectives and different challenges that exist
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
and I feel like to like. as you're you're talking and you high lighted a lot of the questions that we've talked about many many times. Right. who am I? now? what you know? What role do I play? What value do I bring? What worth do I have? If I'm not contributing financially, what's my role? and I've done a lot of this to, and I think there's a lot of work that. It's also just the internal work that we have to do for ourselves to like. I,
lauren_gold:
M.
emily_gorrie:
I think also right. in. Also grateful I didn't start that fight in the coffee shop. Because and I own that, I think a lot to my ability to reflect, and maybe I was journaling at the exact right time, so I was able
lauren_gold:
Yes,
emily_gorrie:
just to write some of those frustrations down as I was feeling them, and could reflect on that. Why what does this Bring up for me? What am I feeling in this moment That makes me so angry that these women are talking about that and it's like maybe it's just personal work that has to get done to, so we can have our own confidence in ourselves that we're in the right place for us, and if we're not identify, what would work better for us to make
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
some changes that we can then have those conversations with our friends and get curious about
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
different perspectives.
lauren_gold:
here, here's here's the truth for me. I'm questioning my own choices right. I'm questioning
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
my own choices. I'm questioning my path while simultaneously being worried about the judgment of others
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
Right. like women, we go through enough right and everyone seems to have something to say to a woman to the working mom to stay at home, Mom that everything in between, mom, the formula, The breast feeding mom, the combo feeding mom, etcetera etcetera. you might feel guilty for working, or you might feel guilty for not working. sounds to me like there's goin to
emily_gorrie:
No,
lauren_gold:
be guilt and judgment either way right, So shouldn't
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
we all just feel like empowered to do what works for us and and not question you know what fits our own lives? I mean, I don't know. And yet we feel judge right, or we feel pressured by Friends, or, and even our, the, our own friends, the women in our lives
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
who claim to be our closest allies. Right and here, I just admitted it. I said I was maybe opening up more to riends in my exact life stage because I wasn't necessarily like opening up to my other best friends who made different choices than me. So
emily_gorrie:
Who would
lauren_gold:
like
emily_gorrie:
feel differently?
lauren_gold:
right. so or have a different perspective? So can we like as women feel empowered in our choices and trust our instinct. Really, that we're doing right by ourselves, our families, our children, even our careers right. Whether we've token like, chosen to take these purposeful pauses, as I like to say, or stay in the work for us, or start our small businesses, etcetera, I mean, don't we just have to own it at some point because we're going through enough. We know we don't need the ladies at Star books, Um, running on our parades or the voices in our heads, Really Like viewing
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
us off course right,
emily_gorrie:
yeah, yeah, I love that perspective because yes, I mean at some point like can we just say enough is enough and I'm just like, really fed up with letting other people's perspectives like pivot make changes in my own life like you're They're not the one that's living my life. So like, Let me just do what works for me and I feel like In simplicity that's easier said than done right.
lauren_gold:
Yes,
emily_gorrie:
there's always a little bit. I always find I have this like gumption when I re, remember that I'm like, Yes, I'm going to live by that moto. I've got this. I've got this and then like as time goes on, wanes a little bit, and then I have to remind myself of that you know approach to life. Um, I just really hope because it really is such a bummer that like we Have yet to get a buyin. I mean, we've spent how many decades now right since, like the women's movement making such
lauren_gold:
M
emily_gorrie:
strides And we're so we're way further along than we have been right. There's been some pretty scary setbacks over the last year or so. but like
lauren_gold:
For sure,
emily_gorrie:
how I feel like we're so close yet we're so far in making these societal changes to a point where women are willing to recognize their role in The stagnation of any movement forward right now, right, whether
lauren_gold:
Yes,
emily_gorrie:
it be in the patriarchy or incorporate America, or I mean, they're all kind of the same, but you know, like in other facets, like we, as individuals, can stand up and we can talk to our friends, but it's like at some point something I's got to give.
lauren_gold:
Oh, for sure. I mean, I think I mentioned this article to you the other day about. maybe it wasn't an article. It was a blog on Mother, entitled Love that Account,
emily_gorrie:
Yes, yep,
lauren_gold:
and it was about pink collar work. These jobs that have been historically very judged jobs that made less money like, like secretarial, work it, or care giving. And how maybe we need to re, think our perception of these jobs, the version That today is a mominfluencer, This word influence or and
emily_gorrie:
M,
lauren_gold:
everyone grown right, But think about these like women online there. They've got these sort of part time jobs or sales jobs, or these accounts. Maybe they're doing some paid adds. Um, and we all grown right because we think it's annoying or we. we don't value that work somehow, shouldn't we be? I don't know, applauding women for trying to build businesses or bring in in. Well, also supporting their families and this like weird influence space. we all grown, but we also all follow them.
emily_gorrie:
Uh,
lauren_gold:
We follow
emily_gorrie:
uh,
lauren_gold:
them and we send
emily_gorrie:
I'm very
lauren_gold:
the
emily_gorrie:
much influenced
lauren_gold:
product recommendation.
emily_gorrie:
by them.
lauren_gold:
I, A, yeah, I'm Hasha influence right and
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
ultimately
emily_gorrie:
Me
lauren_gold:
these
emily_gorrie:
too.
lauren_gold:
women. what are they doing? This block post was like, Hey, these influences they're building community. they're building comradery among women. They're creating spaces to educate and empower On top of Yes, making money Right through like, let's say Instagram as a platform. Why why is there? Why is there shame in that work? Um, and maybe we need to examine like those like you mentioned, M, l, Ms, or whatever it is, and say maybe I'm part of that's to me, it's patriarchal to be judging women for trying to carve a path for themselves while while also raising their families, right.
emily_gorrie:
I think that's so interesting. Maybe that's it. We just start reflecting on our own behavior because I mean for a long time Would not say I was ever like hefty judgmental like, but I think there are times when I was like Oh, this feels sales to something that somebody posted on Instagram and I was like
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
Oh, I can feel that they're trying to get somebody to buy something from them. And you know I worked in sales for a long time. Like that was my
lauren_gold:
Hm,
emily_gorrie:
granted, Incorporate text. So like, not really one to one, but I worked in. You know more of the Btabspace. but like for me, I really prided myself on like relatability and like not feeling like I'm In something. and that was like my. That was my path. So for me I was like, I felt always just a little bit like a back track for
lauren_gold:
M.
emily_gorrie:
women. In my role of like that just makes us look so sleazy, or whatever,
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
totally different I recognize now, but it's like Oh, I was a part of the problem then, right those moments
lauren_gold:
Maybe
emily_gorrie:
where I found myself maybe judging her, whoever this person is, when really she was just showing the F up and trying to just do what worked for her that day. And
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
why can't we applaud her? I mean, that takes a lot of gut, because there are a lot of people including women like myself at the time who were growning, Uh, that type of strategy to flexibility and freedom and best of both worlds, maybe to be with our kids
lauren_gold:
M.
emily_gorrie:
and to be making some money at the same time.
lauren_gold:
Yeah, you know I'm thinking about it now, too. you know we grown like someone's selling me make up or essential oils or whatever, but someone's buying it right, so shouldn't
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
we just be supportive? I mean, I'm not going to buy it if I don't want it, but
emily_gorrie:
Well,
lauren_gold:
I guess
emily_gorrie:
you can be
lauren_gold:
I
emily_gorrie:
supportive.
lauren_gold:
guess I should judge her. Yeah, I should judge her less if it's some. if it's some creative outlet for her. If you happen to love, make up and you're really passionate about making women feel good about themselves. For example, though through beauty Like go, go for it, go forth and conquer, Right and those
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
those sales skills like that will help you. I mean you, and I've even talked about this like okay, depending on how many kids you have or the gap in the ages between those kids. At some point all of your kids are going to go to elementary school right, and yes, that span, it might not be zero to five but five years because you might have some other kids in there, but at some
emily_gorrie:
Hm,
lauren_gold:
point all of your kids are going to you
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
know, be in school and then So you know, when we talk about like this shift to becoming a stay at home, mom, people look at me like I've walked away from my job forever. I've walked away from my career forever,
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
and and I'm never going back and like Well, maybe that's is just my reality right now and right, and maybe that woman selling makeup on mine Like, maybe that's just what she's doing right now, and in five five years when her kids go off to school, she could then transition into a sales job, a more traditional
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
sales job, that is, or maybe her, her make up business well Of all so much. I mean, I don't know. so something I talk about in my client sessions know. oftentimes women are struggling with this. You know, I don't know if I should go back to work if I should. I'm like. Just so you know, I know this decision feels really big right now, but no decision that you're making is forever and all you can do is make the best decision for yourself right now with the information that you have and I sort of explain. I'm like, Okay, You're telling me that you're having two kids. At some point they're going to school. You're
emily_gorrie:
Uh,
lauren_gold:
going to go back right. And so,
emily_gorrie:
yeah,
lauren_gold:
If you choose to pause now, or if you choose to stay, stay in. this is all temporary right. this is
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
all changing.
emily_gorrie:
yeah, I love that I think to, and maybe we let's talk a little bit about the transferable skill set that you get when you are even a stay at home on. like, think about all of the bad as stuff that you do on a regular basis Like it's not
lauren_gold:
M.
emily_gorrie:
easy to do what we're doing right now, and I think there's
lauren_gold:
No,
emily_gorrie:
a lot, um forgetfulness around, and maybe fear, or I don't want to say shame, but there's fear around. Will what I'm doing now translate back into the corporate world, or am I going to be obsolete because my skill in a corporate world haven't continued continuously like haven't been used continuously
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
in that setting, And I
lauren_gold:
yeah,
emily_gorrie:
think there's a lot of fear around that, but in reality there's so much transferable skill said that we learn a stay at home moms And be transferred to that.
lauren_gold:
A couple of things. I mean, some of the fear is valid. I mean, there are plenty of statistics
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
on. You know what happens when you step away from work and then come back, and how that impacts your higher ability, your salary trajectory, Your overall, you know, lifetime, n, com, et cetera We know that, I mean that is leaning, Um, et cetera, So
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
some of that fear is valid, Um, but some of it is. I think how how we own our story. How you show up for an interview If you can own it, and say I took a pause, or you know, and I mean with
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
Covid and everything of the past couple of years, we've seen a ton of lay offs, particularly in tech in the last six nine months, Like a lot of lay offs. How are you going to show up to that next interview? right? I got laid off one month into my maternity view. Leave, you know,
emily_gorrie:
M,
lauren_gold:
I'm hearing stories like that right
emily_gorrie:
yeah,
lauren_gold:
and to be able to own the story and say, I took some time to re evaluate what I wanted, I took some time with my family, and every single day I had Two I don't know, face up to all my stuff, so I make sure I won't bring it into my parent Ing project, managed an entire household time management. You know, to get us out the door to our activities or whatever it is, the logistics. I mean, you could go
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
on and on and on. I mean like this. this. I'm learning more. I don't know. I've never worked harder. I've never been more passionate. I've never felt more fulfilled by my work. I've never put in more hours, or I've never, And so exhausted as I have in my current life stage, And if that's the energy of bringing to an interview, you know, hey, I'm I'm proud of how far I've come. Um right, like I think, that sort of the messaging for someone who maybe takes a break and comes back, But over all, even if I'm never going back to a traditional, you know nine to five situation, I don't know. I would say I'm
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
proud of how far I've come. This journey of mine has been so much harder than I ever ever Ever could have expected. and I would say to anyone out there feeling judged for your choices, I say, own it right, and stick with the people in your life who make you feel supported. And if you're navigating
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
a job hunt at some point you'll know very quickly, right if someone respects women and respects families and respects career pauses right
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
when you're in that interview process, don't you think?
emily_gorrie:
Absolutely. and I think I mean, you're like high lighting all these amazing things that we do and I also just like think about how much research you've done, Lawrence, like on different baby topics and sleep and these vaccines,
lauren_gold:
M?
emily_gorrie:
and like this weird like world that we're navigating like I don't know what I would have done without you like you were my rabbit hole
lauren_gold:
Oh,
emily_gorrie:
like I was like, Oh, I
lauren_gold:
thank
emily_gorrie:
trust
lauren_gold:
you.
emily_gorrie:
Lawrence, like we are so aligned and you did so much of that research right Like, but educate yourself like, think about that like. I feel like when I was working corporately, Not that I like never was pro active and like, I mean, I was constantly learning new things like when you're in tech like things are constantly changing Like you know, The
lauren_gold:
Yes,
emily_gorrie:
Algarithems are always updating whatever, so you always have to educate yourself and be on the forefront of Like different, you know, themes or whatever, But like, I
lauren_gold:
Right,
emily_gorrie:
never had to learn something except for the initial get go of With a company. like I never had to be constantly up dating my knowledge repertoire. I'm like, Oh my God, my daughter didn't sleep last night. What is going on? is it
lauren_gold:
I
emily_gorrie:
sickness?
lauren_gold:
know,
emily_gorrie:
Is it regressions? is it she's cold? is it my house? Is
lauren_gold:
Uh
emily_gorrie:
you know,
lauren_gold:
huh,
emily_gorrie:
and then it comes to like you know behavior all because we're going into
lauren_gold:
Right,
emily_gorrie:
tollerhood and it's like Oh my God, if she screams now at at me one more time, like how do I handle this? I don't want to get upset
lauren_gold:
Right,
emily_gorrie:
and I get to mess up her brain. Am I gonna you know?
lauren_gold:
Ah,
emily_gorrie:
make her into something
lauren_gold:
scar
emily_gorrie:
I don't
lauren_gold:
my child,
emily_gorrie:
Want her to be. Scar my child.
lauren_gold:
right.
emily_gorrie:
You know, there's all these things that we like take on, so I just want to highlight that too right like I've never done this type of work
lauren_gold:
Oh,
emily_gorrie:
corporately.
lauren_gold:
For sure, Right and isn't that? Isn't that parenthood? Just when you think you've got it figured out something changes and I felt like that in my traditional job, too. Just when our team found
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
astride there was a rear right or somebody left
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
or somebody got promoted or your problems changed, or you know, New Year new goals, I mean, such is
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
life right, and so again, To our point about judgment and shifting the conversation and recognizing all the work, the hard work that goes into Everything. I mean,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
I don't know, but back to the world of influencing righting content creation, we feel like it's just like a woman. Like taking like a cool, pick or video and uploading it. I think that feeds into this narrative and society of valuing work. I mean, ask any person with a social
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
media present tons of work that goes into the marketing of that side hustle or that that account, photography, content creation, writing contracts, negotiations, posting The analytic, I mean, it's work. We need to shift
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
our perception of the side hustle, the Essential Oils business, the podcast, The Mom influence or whatever, I don't know. I mean, we're all
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
all working so hard and that's what I said earlier. and like women, we're going through enough as it is. I just think everyone
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
needs to lean into some compassion
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, I'm ready to hire some of those people I like. Can you create me a marketing strategy Because
lauren_gold:
Right
emily_gorrie:
I don't have the time or really the desire to educate myself on that to create myself A strategy right to crack this like extremely Volatile environment like I feel like everything is changing. It's always changing like I don't have the time or the energy for that Like I want to lean on my fellow ladies and a man. I shouldn't say. there aren't any men in that
lauren_gold:
Right?
emily_gorrie:
in that industry, But like who have taken the time to actually do that work. Because it is, it is work. It's a lot of work that I don't want to do. Um,
lauren_gold:
For sure?
emily_gorrie:
I don't know. I don't know. I just I do love these conversations because it makes me feel better that we actually are Further along in this than I maybe initially felt when we started this conversation, which is so nice because I'm not as like overwhelmed any more, because I want to support my fellow lady, but I don't know. We just have so much more work to do.
lauren_gold:
Yeah, I think socitely we're getting there and I also like, like to remember, we are one country right in the world that's
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
getting there. I think different countries are further ahead and some countries are further behind. I mean more and more companies were hearing in the United States are giving paternity leave or their expanding their maternity leave policies. Obviously, you know the Us over. I mean the Us. government. I don't feel supported. You know, I don't think the United
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
States and on a whole support Women and families. But but we're moving. you know, I think like slowly inching forward. Um, yeah, I don't know, getting a little, getting a little off topic there. but
emily_gorrie:
That's what we do.
lauren_gold:
like
emily_gorrie:
That's
lauren_gold:
society,
emily_gorrie:
what we do. So I know well, I feel I don't know. I just feel like we have some good steps at this point and I'm always so comforted by just having you to talk to because I think there's like steps. right. Okay, we know, Like reflection is so key, right, personal reflection on where are we coming from in this moment? Like what's making us feel uncomfortable? Are we judging ourselves for something for judging this other Person? Like? And just I also want to say, Like being supportive doesn't nesessarily mean like you always have to buy right. Like being
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
supportive can be the like of a post can be a share of a post to somebody, or it could be a text message to somebody who's going through something similar that at some point you've gone through and you are lending a listening ear right like there's
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
a way to support without even really knowing exactly what you're walking Into without having to do it like financially, I think with a lot of the Frustration or worth is placed on that financial piece, Like am I bringing in enough money or the only way to support these people is to give them money, And I don't have a lot of that money and we get really into this like weird cycle of like finances and money and
lauren_gold:
M.
emily_gorrie:
the worth in the value we place on it in the
lauren_gold:
Yes,
emily_gorrie:
society, and we live in a capitalistic country, so unfortunately
lauren_gold:
Right,
emily_gorrie:
its necessity. but there are so many more ways to support Your community around you, but also women who you just come in contact with without having to spend your money. I mean if
lauren_gold:
Yeah,
emily_gorrie:
you can
lauren_gold:
I
emily_gorrie:
great
lauren_gold:
think
emily_gorrie:
do it,
lauren_gold:
I mentioned to you something like I felt, I think, particularly in my first year. Like post part, I felt called to uh, reach out to women more in my perifery like, as opposed to
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
my really tighten it circle. But you know that old friend that I used to know, or who I worked with two jobs ago, or whatever, who kind of posts about their new born or their struggles I started. I found myself it was a little weird as a little socially strange, but I found myself like kind of reaching out to people like Instagramdm's, like after they posted something on their story or shooting a random text to someone after I heard that they had had a child and just saying like, hey, you know how are you doing? You know. I know you know. I just got through that stage or whatever. My baby is only a few months older than your baby. Um, and I found myself like really gravitating towards those kinds of car Versations and being like, How are you? How are you doing?
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
in a way that I never would have done right prior to having a child, but suddenly I felt like I was in this world where I just wanted to be understood and I wanted to make other women feel like understood or heard, and
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
it came up in my client sessions to it like the astrology thing, which is just these recurring themes like you're talking about, like the infant sleep or starting to walk, Starting to talk or starting solid, or coming back from that, leave and being really upset, or you know, struggling to find good care care providers, Date cares, Nanny's illness is. Um, I don't know just all of these themes like. it just seems like the best way for me to support others was to put out the support that maybe I needed when I was in that given stage
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
and say like, Just so you know you're not alone, Right and I Of having, I think some really interesting conversations and re connecting with the periferal
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
friends, the frit the edge, Um,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
in ways that I, I don't think I ever would have done right prior prior to this motherhood journey. You know,
emily_gorrie:
Absolutely. I think it's so funny You say that because as I'm listening to you, it's like there's also something to be said about. For me. There's a fear of being judged by the people that matter the most to me, So like letting the people down that
lauren_gold:
M
emily_gorrie:
are like my closest inner circle. So like I found a lot of the time I was talking to. So you and I. Our friendship was new at the time. right when our girls were little.
lauren_gold:
Right.
emily_gorrie:
we been through this together, so for for me, you were actually one of the like, Still like we hadn't like when the girls we first met it. we weren't like we were. We clicked. but like took us a little bit of time to like Right,
lauren_gold:
Sure,
emily_gorrie:
grow into this friendship. I did natural, and I think for
lauren_gold:
Course
emily_gorrie:
a while it was easier for me to share these things with you because you were going through something similar, But be like you didn't really know my history.
lauren_gold:
Exactly
emily_gorrie:
There wasn't anything for you to like. reflect on like, Oh, she's doing worse than she was doing, or
lauren_gold:
Right.
emily_gorrie:
better than she was doing, or there was no nothing for you to compare it to, So I find that there's like a lot of fear for myself of being judged by the people that know me the best.
lauren_gold:
Absolutely
emily_gorrie:
That is actually quite nice To find support on the periferal, so you can build that confidence in yourself to then share with the people that are closest to you
lauren_gold:
For sure. I mean you, just you just nailed it for me. Why was I confiding in you? I, who I knew for maybe two or three months more
emily_gorrie:
Right,
lauren_gold:
than I was confiding in some of my friends who I've known since childhood since high school. Since college. Why? I mean, even you know, my friends brought up to me recently like they had no idea. I mean, I spoke about it so casual. They had no idea I was going through what I was going through when I was going through it like
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
interesting, and I, I think you're right where we're afraid. I mean, they're also like mirrors, right, and they? You're
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
going to go to the people who are going to give you the advice that you got her. In that moment I'm like Well, I can't go to them because they're going to give me
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
the tough love or whatever. But it is really interesting to reflect. It is really interesting to look back and say Why was I talking to my friends, old co worker or my friend of a friend
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
of a friend, Right, instead of some of my best friends in the world, Right? And and I'll
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
tell you now, I think back to our original topic. Some of that was because some of my best friends were working and they were back to work and I wasn't
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
and I felt maybe there was a dichotomy there. And now I think that was silly right. I think
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
we've since had those conversations and I think the true friends right won't judge you. I don't know. I don't know.
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, I think too, right. There's also for me. It was a lot of my friends hadn't had children yet, so it was not. I didn't have
lauren_gold:
M.
emily_gorrie:
people that I in correctly. in my mind, this wasn't actually true, but in my mind felt like I didn't have people that I could go and actually share the realities of motherhood for
lauren_gold:
Right,
emily_gorrie:
me, because they couldn't relate or would want to try. but would I and solve that, You know, there's just a lot of disconnect for me and I real Is now. Right if I look back on it like those women know me the best. They don't need to know motherhood right. They know me very well, so they're able to hold space for me regardless of what I'm going through. And we've like you said since had these conversations of this is why I was. so. The walls went up for me because I feel like they couldn't understand, or they feel like they couldn't relate, and they would have judgment on me
lauren_gold:
M,
emily_gorrie:
and I didn't want to have them have any sort of judgment Or me pass judgment on them on how hard motherhood is in case they wanted to do it.
lauren_gold:
That's
emily_gorrie:
Um,
lauren_gold:
a good point,
emily_gorrie:
which I also see now is like part of the problem,
lauren_gold:
Right. It's also
emily_gorrie:
so
lauren_gold:
shiny, so shiny and wonderful with rainbows and unicorns on the motherhood side, so come on over it,
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
but that's not
emily_gorrie:
yeah,
lauren_gold:
true. That's not
emily_gorrie:
no,
lauren_gold:
true
emily_gorrie:
it's really hard. There are rainbows and it is shiny a lot of times, but there are also some dark clouds, Um, some thunderstorms and turbulence and it all leads to greener pastures, But
lauren_gold:
Hope. so I'm just getting
emily_gorrie:
well we have to tell ourselves that laurent.
lauren_gold:
so I know something that someone someone said to me in my early post part. I was freaking out. I mean, I was just exhausted and nursing and I don't know. I didn't you know hormonal, whatever it was, and I said to a dear friend of mine. I said I'm so embarrassed That the things I used to be upset about like upset me like I thought I thought
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
those things mattered then and now I see that they didn't. They felt they felt so small, silly and insignificant compared to what I was really going through right now, Um, meaning I was really feeling just like the gravity of motherhood in this identity shift, And and all of that and my friend said to me, That's where you're wrong. Those things mattered then because they were happening then, and these things matter now because they're happening now. But the bigger picture
emily_gorrie:
M,
lauren_gold:
is none of it matters And it's all temporary and that hit me like a ton of bricks, because I was doing the same thing five. ten years ago. My problems felt so big and looming and large because they were my problems that day, and the point my friend
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
was making was the big, looming large problem, Ms, of motherhood and breast feeding and parenting, and most part that you're feeling today will also fade right,
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
and one day you'll have the perspective and you'll look back on these things and you'll wonder why you judge yourself so harshly or why you felt so judged by others.
emily_gorrie:
M,
lauren_gold:
And it was right.
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
Such a lesson, such a lesson that everything we're going through is going to fate. Right,
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
It does
emily_gorrie:
yes,
lauren_gold:
matter. it does matter. we need to have these conversations. It is important your feelings are valued, your problems. your feelings are valid and your problems are real,
emily_gorrie:
Yes,
lauren_gold:
and and this to this too shall pass, and
emily_gorrie:
Yep,
lauren_gold:
I find myself coming back to that theme and in some of my astrology sessions, my coaching sessions, which is, Yeah, you're navigating your twenties, and you don't know where to move or what Job to take or if this guy is right for you. Yeah, those problems are real, and
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
and you're a new mom in your early thirties or whatever it is? You know, debating coming back from that leave in the job, But you hate it or not at the job, and wishing you were back to work or navigating your child care dramas. It's all real. It's all real and it's also all temporary.
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's the end right. It's the end that I think we have to remind ourselves of of Like this can be hard and I can be really grateful
lauren_gold:
Hm.
emily_gorrie:
And these are my problems and those problems are very real for somebody else. So who are we to? Yeah, judge and say that ours are less than or theirs are less than, Because we are very much in these moments of navigating them. It's so true. it's just so true, and in time it will, you will navigate them. Because you have no other choice. You will navigate them and you will get on the other side of it.
lauren_gold:
Right, I am to those women in the coffee shop, Right, I am a working mom, Right who feels great about my choices and my friend is not right now, or I am a working
emily_gorrie:
M.
lauren_gold:
mom who maybe has my own doubts about my choices, and I can support my friend who's starting her side. Hustle, whatever it is, I love this concept of the ant.
emily_gorrie:
Yeah, yeah, it's like. why, Like linked in can be a profile for corporate people to meet in network and do their thing, And it can be a beautiful space for people who were a part of that to share there Different endeavors.
lauren_gold:
I did put a full time parent n break on my linkedin. I was talking about
emily_gorrie:
Nice.
lauren_gold:
this with a friend the other day.
emily_gorrie:
nice.
lauren_gold:
I wasn't
emily_gorrie:
yeah,
lauren_gold:
sure what I wanted to do with it. I mean, I've had this side hustle for a long time, but I didn't technically you know, go out with it, come public with it until a few months ago and I said No, You know, I'm going to be real about this and say no from July of twenty twenty one, until whenever you know, whenever I did it, I'm going to say like that was a full time I tink break, and I'm going to own that. it's on my resume now right, it's not going anywhere.
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
And and maybe that's what we do Right we own,
emily_gorrie:
Hm,
lauren_gold:
we own the resume. we own the parenting pause, and the Aus goes there. The pausegoes
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
on the resume.
emily_gorrie:
yeah, and we challenge the judgment.
lauren_gold:
Yes, both self judgment and the judgment of others
emily_gorrie:
Yes, good good qualify the yeah, self judgment and the outside judgment,
lauren_gold:
Exactly
emily_gorrie:
because it's there. I mean, if we feel the outside judgment, there's internal judgment. That's the reason why we see it. There's
lauren_gold:
Right.
emily_gorrie:
a level of us already doubting, So
lauren_gold:
And that's why
emily_gorrie:
that's
lauren_gold:
you almost caused a fight and a coffee shop.
emily_gorrie:
That is why, and that is why we were having this conversation Becase. there was internal judgment and
lauren_gold:
All
emily_gorrie:
doubt
lauren_gold:
right
emily_gorrie:
for myself on what these personal choices I made are.
lauren_gold:
Right
emily_gorrie:
Thankfully,
lauren_gold:
right,
emily_gorrie:
I arranged myself in and I realized that so we are not talking arrest records
lauren_gold:
Just
emily_gorrie:
for
lauren_gold:
get
emily_gorrie:
myself.
lauren_gold:
it, just for the record. You were never going to do that
emily_gorrie:
No, maybe maybe ten years ago, maybe ten years ago.
lauren_gold:
Pre
emily_gorrie:
Wait
lauren_gold:
mom.
emily_gorrie:
before you knew me.
lauren_gold:
You're a
emily_gorrie:
Yeah,
lauren_gold:
mother
emily_gorrie:
pre
lauren_gold:
now,
emily_gorrie:
mom fain myself In that's it. That's it. Well, I think maybe let's wrap it up there, Laurence. Thank you so much for having this conversation with me. I think there's so many valuable nuggets in this that my hope is that we've at least opened somebody else's eyes to a different perspective on motherhood and careers and judgement, and just how we can move forward Support one another.
lauren_gold:
Thank you. it was such an honor to be here. I really, I really just appreciate these conversations and thank you for having them and for putting them out there in the form of this podcast. And yeah, I hope we can do this again. Thank you for having me.
emily_gorrie:
Yes, of course, and I will make sure to link all of your social handles to, so people can take a look and interact with you and engage with you and follow along on this new passion project of yours.
lauren_gold:
Thank you. Yes, you can find me at, as told by Lauren Gold, and we can continue the conversation there. So thank you so much, Emily.
emily_gorrie:
Love it, thanks, Laurence.